DCist: Know Your Metro History

yonas

Tue, 22 Apr 2008 14:00:36 -0500

Interesting....you learn something new every day. I always thought it was because the uppity residents of Georgetown didn't want any public-transportation-taking riffraff in their neighborhoods.

Chris

Wed, 29 Mar 2006 19:41:58 -0500

I was so glad to find this article! Just ordered the book. I am a lonely public transit enthusiast in Baltimore. Every time I go to DC, I lament that Baltimoreans didn't have the same foresight as DC folk. The Metro is pretty much the ONLY thing I like about DC better than Baltimore (which I'm sure a lot of people will scoff at :-)). As most of you probably know, we have ONE Metro line that goes from Owings Mills (NW suburbs) through downtown to Johns Hopkins Hospital (an oasis of money in an otherwise nightmarish urban landscape, although that's about change). It's ridiculous. I could go on for hours. But thanks for the interesting thread and for the heads up on a hopefully fascinating book!

Matt

Fri, 24 Mar 2006 15:06:36 -0500

Very true, ms.

ms

Fri, 24 Mar 2006 13:06:22 -0500

Matt, I am sorry if I did not explain myself. I do think public transit is a great thing to have in major cities. I was just pointing out that many people would rather drive their car than take the metro even if public transportation is faster and less costly.

Matt

Fri, 24 Mar 2006 12:03:32 -0500

MS - it is, but there are plenty of major cities with residents who don't own cars; I live in DC and don't own one anymore because, as you said, it cost too much and was a hassle. But "most of the United States [is] 'car-centric'" isn't really a good justification for major cities not having viable public transit systems.

ms

Fri, 24 Mar 2006 11:44:56 -0500

Isn't most of the United States "car-centric" in nature? The only place I have been to where cars aren't used by residents is NY City. There it costs too much or is a hastle to even keep a car in the city. My friends who live there either don't have a car or leave it with a relative in NJ or LI.

Matt

Fri, 24 Mar 2006 11:37:27 -0500

I agree - fortunately it's hip to live in the city and (well, at least during the high gas prices post-Katrina) hip to use public transit, but considering the sheer amount of people who live and work far from transit, yeah, they're all screwed.

MB

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 18:14:49 -0500

The Atlanta metro area is screwed, with regard to public transport. The distances that must be covered are vast, and the culture/infrastructure is so car-centric as to make LA look like a pedestrian's paradise. I fear that things are going to get a lot worse in Atlanta before they get even think about getting better. Metro gets rightfully slagged for all sorts of things, but any time I get too annoyed, I just think back to my MARTA days. And a calm overcomes.

Matt

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 17:59:13 -0500

It was Gwinnett County as a whole that didn't want MARTA, not just the City of Duluth. And yes, the "criminal element" factor was mentioned numerous times. Of course, I can't say whether it was viewed as a viable transit solution or just a toy train for people to take to sporting events; I'm guessing the latter.

Mike B.

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 17:07:55 -0500

I don't mind the station lighting so much as I hate the lighting in the older cars. Love the brighter lighting in the new cars, though I can't tell if it's just due to a new type of lighting system or the fact that the plastic covers in the new cars are still relatively clear.

MB

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 17:00:09 -0500

I love the dim lights of the Metro, and am rather annoyed when a station replaces the existing lights with something brighter. There's something about the low lighting that makes the transition into the day a little easier, and seems to soothe down the noise. Also, I know no one but me probably cares, but calling Duluth part of NE Atlanta is sort of like calling Baltimore part of NE DC. Except even fewer people want to go to Duluth. In any event, I'm so thankful that I deal with Metro, and not MARTA, on a daily basis now.

MM

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 16:47:39 -0500

The "tiltrotor" scheme is no crazier than canning the head of WMATA and then paying him millions of dollars!

Gary

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 16:44:28 -0500

NOW i find it! "There was even a study in the early 1990s that proposed a series of civil tiltrotor stations as a possible commuting option from places such as Reston, Manassas, Leesburg, Columbia, and other points in the greater Washington area." From wikipedia. Kind of hard to believe. How far did this go?

Gary

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 16:36:00 -0500

You're going to think I'm crazy, but one night I was randomly googling Metro-related terms and I read two articles that mentioned that there were briefly plans to link end-of-the-line stations with the exurbs with regularly scheduled helicopter service. Seriously. I read that. I can't find the links now (I think they called it something other than "helicopter.) Anyone ever hear anything about that?

Dan S.

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 16:23:04 -0500

xaosdc : Have you checked with Olsson's -- I'm sure they have it in stock, and you can even order online for an in-store pick-up.

Grasshopper

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 16:15:46 -0500

Figures that an old grasshopper would be writing about the Metro...which did not have a station within 4 miles of the old GDS building on MacArthur Blvd. The D4 bus was the bane of our collective existence, and we spent a great deal of time cursing the Georgetown nobility for making us take it all the way across town to the Dupont subway. Can't wait to read this!!

TC The Terrible

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 16:07:47 -0500

Dang! First George Mason cracks the Sweet 16, and now they are educating us on the Metro. And who was it saying Mason would never be a real school? ;-) Does the book contain anything about why there is only one line into NOVA? TC

Rob

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 15:28:26 -0500

To respond to a few items: - I purchased the book at Politics & Prose, and suspect most other independent bookshops are carrying it - just a quick call to find out. - A reader pointed out that institutional actors certainly impacted where stations would be built - The University of Maryland for one lobbied for an off-campus station. He doesn't cover this in detail, I'm interested in learning more. The reader suggested a similar thing happened with Howard, however I don't know anything about what they thought about the station location. - As to safety, Schrag addresses the fears by some that a Metro station would increase crime briefly in the book. He concludes any impact has been negligable at most and the system is relatively safe for its large size, however I don't think there's been any systematic study of the matter. He points out the stations were deliberately designed to be as open as possible to prevent dark corners. - Also, as for the lighting, Schrag says that the installed system was actually a bit darker than the engineers had planned for various reasons ...

Reid

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 15:05:59 -0500

"I'd love to see a metro station illuminated like the one on the cover of that book." Really? It doesn't look that different to me. The sound dampenors in the coffers might make it look brighter, but then again the shutter speed of the camera can always make a room look lighter or darker than it really is.

M

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:58:36 -0500

I'd love to see a metro station illuminated like the one on the cover of that book. The stations are now so dreary and it's hard to read. Someone once told me the stations were designed to be well lit, but wmata doesn't do a good job of replacing burnt out lights.

xaosdc

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:49:26 -0500

Anyone know where this can be purchased in DC? (Not Amazon...I'm impaitent)

DC1974

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:39:03 -0500

Remember too that Georgetown proper wasn't much in the 1970s. Still a working port with some biker bars and head shops. Not the pseudo mall it is today. The interview on Kojo was really interesting. I actually might buy the book. I'm a huge fan of the Weese (the architect) and a geek about transit planning. (Note also that the 395 tunnel under the mall was supposed to be open air, so that riders could have a view of the Capitol!)

Matt

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:25:04 -0500

Reid - I think that's the site where I learned about the station in the first place. Not only have I seen the non-revenue tunnel at Farragut Square, but I've also seen the spur tunnel at the Pentagon built for the planned-but-never-built Columbia Pike line.

Reid

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:21:16 -0500

Re: Dulles Metro Stop, from a great site dedicated to Washington transportation history: http://www.clouse.org/metro.html#Dulles%20Airport%20Rail%20Tunnel. This site has me now staring off into the dark tunnels hoping to catch a glimpse of the non-revenue line that enables cars to change from the Red to the Orange/Blue line around Farragut.

Matt

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:03:37 -0500

"and the river crossing would have meant the station would have to be prohibitively deep" What, deeper than Forest Glen or Wheaton? I'm willing to buy the "not enough concentration of jobs/residents" argument but not that one. Any discussion of the rumored built-but-not-occupied Metro station under Dulles Airport?

Kate

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:57:48 -0500

Maybe I missed this, but did you guys not link to the interview of author Zach Schrag on the Kojo Nnamdi show today? It's was at noon (and will be on again tonight at 8) and here's a link to the Kojo page. The segment should be available to listen to online around 2pm. http://www.wamu.org/programs/kn/06/03/23.php

ms

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:54:18 -0500

I agree with your points Reid. Crime can occur in many forms and people should be able to be fearful of crime without bringing in a "race" component, but thats the first thing that came to mind when I heard of the opposition to the MARTA station. Its always hard to prove racism and I know from being a southern white male that too many people are too quick to pre-judge southerns and call them racist for anything that might seem anti-black or anti-progressive. Still, I feel sorry for those that call people racist simply because others don't agree with them. Calling someone a racist not only make the person look stupid but its often the easy way to try to win an argument. Its a lazy man's debate tool. I experienced it many times. Either I am racist or sexist for disagreeing with blacks, females, or whoever on "their" issues. With that said, I do believe that the AJC did show the undercurrent of racist beliefs from the Duluth station opponents. Was it clear cut? Probably not, but I know the area. Its rich southern elite families mixed in with old style country people. Many of these people are the most wonderful people you would ever run into, but some old habbits die hard. I didn't doubt the racist aspect then and I don't now.

Reid

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:42:44 -0500

As a follow up: Has anyone taken a look at what trasportation Washington-based criminals have used to prey on PG County residents? I would guess it was mostly by car, but I'd be curious to see what patterns there are.

Reid

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:39:03 -0500

ms, couldn't someone take the subway and mug them of their wallet? Break in to their house and steal jewelry? Not every burglar or mugger is after large items (in fact I would imagine it would always be better to go after smaller more valuable things than a bulky TV, which is a pain to carry and could easily break) I'm not saying the decision to stop the station was correct or not based on racism, but it's not absolutely crazy to imagine a criminal using the subway. Whether or not a subway station being present would increase the likelihood that a criminal targets an area is a different question, but I'm sure it could be used as a transportation option.

AdamsMorganist

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:32:21 -0500

*rabble rabble rabble* Thanks for the heads up on the book. It's now being shipped to me. Amazon should give you a commission or something.

ms

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:01:14 -0500

That is interesting. I know in Atlanta people in Duluth (NE area of ATL) got MARTA to make a change so that a station wouldn't stop in "their" city. The story was heavily reported in the AJC (and is still brought up on occasion). Basically Duluth residents didn't want black inner city gang members to come into their neighboors and steal stuff. I always found that funny because I can picture the scene even now: a young black man carrying a TV onto MARTA so he can transport it back to sell to his other gang buddies. Talk about the most crazy and racist fear people can have.

Gtown

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 12:40:25 -0500

Of course, the lack of a Metro station in Georgetown also serves as a very convenient excuse for us "rabble" who don't ever want to go over there when making plans with friends who do...

Julie

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 12:15:32 -0500

Interesting, that part about the Georgetown metro station...though it doesn't necessarily mean Georgetowners DON'T want to keep the "rabble" out. Very convenient how that works out, eh?

My New Bumper Sticker

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 12:03:51 -0500

Mean Public Things Suck

Sean

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 11:57:49 -0500

The National Building Museum has a whole secion of their "Symbol and City" exhibit dedicated to the beltway debate in the 70's. They have a old blue print, with two beltways loops located withing 495, and a connector freeway going from Maryland, through Adams Morgan, under Dupont Circle, and into downtown.....with only two exits into the rest of the city. Thank GOD they didn't build that.