January 25, 2007
Banned in D.C.: Artists Respond
This week's announcement by D.C. Council Representative Jim Graham that he would seek emergency legislation banning minors from bars and nightclubs has met with some fierce debate. In fact, it's being debated as we speak. But beyond the impact on places of business, much of the fallout will come down on the city's cultural community: musicians, theatre companies and artists who often use these establishments for concerts, benefits, plays, and shows of all kinds. The opportunity to make these events open to all means their reach carries farther, and provides a lot of kids with culture they may otherwise miss out on, as well as fostering a sense of community early in life.
It comes as no surprise, then, that members of D.C.'s music community have been quick to respond.
Dischord Records offered up the following response from label employee Alec Bourgeois:
I grew up in Washington D.C. and I started going to concerts in 1979 when I was 14 years old. The choice for me was very clear at that time, find something useful and creative to do or follow the drug addled battle cry of a generation who was destined for this city's worst. I chose the former. Thankfully this was a time when Washington's underground music scene, both punk rock and go-go, was coming into it's own and many of the band members were themselves under the legal drinking age, which at the time was 18 years old. Rather than being segregated to "minor" status we were embraced by fellow musicians and a select group of club owners who encouraged and supported our efforts to take control of our status and find ways to integrate ourselves, as underage audience and band members, into the larger community.We knew that people were taking a chance on us so took it upon ourselves to show goodwill to local club owners by policing our own shows and drawing "Xs" on our hands to show we were underage so the bartenders knew who not to serve. This cooperation between bands, concert goers and nightclub owners led to the establishment of Washington's world renown all-ages venues, like the 9:30 Club, Black Cat, etc., who tightened up the policies we invented and made them part of their standard operating procedure. I have since toured in both the States and Europe and can tell you first-hand that not only does Washington enjoy an international reputation for musical excellence but is unique in its management of its all-ages music community.
Henry Rollins, who grew up attending shows in D.C., before fronting local hardcore act S.O.A. and then joining up with Black Flag, replied to DCist via email:
I think it's too bad... I am sure every band and underage person is dismayed, to say the least. It's lame that someone thinks that throwing out the baby with the bathwater is the answer. It's always those who shy away from personal responsibility who do stuff like this.
Simple Machines records co-founder Jenny Toomey, one of D.C.'s most vocal musician's advocates, commented yesterday on our story:
Shouldn't we be more worried about violence and gun shots than live music and shots of booze? I went to all ages shows from 16. I've been to, and played at, thousands by now. No one has EVER been shot or stabbed at any of them. They are far safer places for kids than the Keggers or soul killing teenage parties that I avoided by being part of the punk rock scene. In fact, I went to college on a scholarship established by the greiving family of a classmate whose boyfriend had too much to drink and drove her into a wall at one of those parties...We don't need new laws, we need enforcement of the old ones.
Ted Leo, still a favorite son of D.C. music, was shocked that anyone would even try to ban all ages shows and called it a "tragic" development. He highly recommended that everyone involved write their council member using the template Toomey posted on DCist yesterday to express their opposition to the legislation.
Travis Morrison, formerly of the Dismemberment Plan, was similarly angry, and told us he was planning on making his voice heard at this afternoon's public meeting, where we're told that Graham may already be softening his position.
And not to be forgotten, the Bad Brains already dealt with this issue over two decades ago in song, even if their ban wasn't age-based.
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i still don't understand the logic in this law. ban underage kids so they won't be shot, but it's okay to be shot if you're over 21? are bars considred war zones?
There is no logic to it, except a politician's logic -- it allows Jim Graham to appear "tough" on an issue, and the people worst affected by his stance can't vote.
There is no logic to it, except the logic of a political hack -- it allows Jim Graham to appear "tough" on an issue, and the people worst affected by his stance can't vote. Someone in a previous comment thread suggested that he has wider ambitions beyond his current post, and this kind of grandstanding would be consistent with that.
Well, I guess this masterful post settles it, then. It's unimaginable why musicians who stand to lose a few bucks from a measure would be opposed to it, regardless of whether or not they are speaking from their own perspectives, or taking the local community into account.
I think part of my personal disconnect on this issue is that I separate concerts from nightclubs. I believe concerts, as with sporting events, etc. where drinking is allowable, should not have age limits because of the nature of the event. Nightclubs are a completely different environment, whose primary social focus is drinking and flirting, and have no place for minors. Obviously it can be difficult to draw a line at times, but when you look at actual venues and not just speak on vague generalities, I think most people would arrive to the same conclusions about the appropriate age restrictions.
CDTrave, would you consider the Black Cat a nightclub or a concert hall? What about the nightclub 9:30? Should kids only be allowed to go to shows that occur in arenas or pavillions?
Uhhhh, what do flirting and drinking, vs. someone getting shot, have to do with each other? Jim Graham's proposal is supposedly responding to an incident in which someone who was neither drinking, nor flirting, got shot.
We've got much the same ban in Indianapolis, and it's been in place for many years. There's a weird divide here between bars and "all ages" clubs, and it does exclude a lot of potential fans from events. But hey, at least it cuts off their only potential source of alcohol. Feh . . .
in DC, pretty much all of the venues are bar/club.
I sat through the entire seven hours of that council hearing Jim Graham ran on the issue so I could testify as a participant in the rave, goth, house, fetish and gay club cultures and it's clear that (a) his mind was already made up before he heard any testimony, (b) we're screwed, and (c) no, there was absolutely no logic in how he and other supporters discussed the matter. The simple issue of how this is going to prevent violence was left out and the representative from the Alcoholic Beverage Regulatory Administration explicitly stated that weapons-based violence in nightclubs has been at a severe low for quite some time.
Legba, I found your testimony extremely valuable. Graham talked in circles the entire evening. I was about to explode at the end. He was obviously quite illinformed about the nature of the various DC scenes, and right now, I'm just keeping my fingers crossed.
It astonishes me that DC currently allows unaccompanied kids into bars and nightclubs. "Various DC scenes" notwithstanding.
18-to-enter and 21-to-drink makes much more sense, if the drinking ban is enforced rigorously, and if establishments that violate that are punished.
This sort of reminds me. Has anyone done a follow-up on all the DC bars that have closed in the wake of the smoking ban? I'm sure there must be at least one or two. Right?
as a former underage nightclub attendee and current mother, i have to say that kids deserve way more credit than people give them. sure, sketchy things occasionally happen in nightclubs, but they happen everywhere. the focus should be on making sure guns don't get into nightclubs, not punishing kids who want to experience live music.
i started going to shows in DC at 14, and those experiences were a huge, wonderful part of my teen years. to think that my own kids might not have the same freedom is pretty heartbreaking.
here is the text of Jim Graham's auto reply if anyone emailed him:
Thanks for your message. On Thursday (1-25-07), we held a seven hour roundtable on these issues.
We will be continuing our inquiry into the specific events of the night of the killing of Ms Ford, especially as they relate to the MPD and the alcohol regulatory agency. There are at present important, unanswered questions in that regard.
We are also now considering various ideas for inclusion in legislation. We need to establish (not strengthen, as none now exist!) rules on security, training, process for identifying underage persons, and other matters to govern nightclubs that admit minors for bands and other entertainment.
We will probably recommend a regulatory category, into which such all ages venues may choose to transfer.
In point of fact, all but a handful of DC nightclubs presently exclude minors as a matter of business policy. But it is possible—as demonstrated by the 1919 Club—for a nightclub under current law to simply begin offering teen parties. And there are few if any regulations pertaining to such parties.
We will also be considering establishing an age, below which no minor unless accompanied by apparent or guardian may be admitted. AT present there is no such age limit.
I am also concerned about the absence of law pertaining to a licensee’s ability to lease or rent the premises. We need standards and guidelines for that as well.
We can do all of this in a way where responsible music experiences will still be available, but with regulation….which, at present, does not exist.
We will have more developments soon. Thank you for your interest.
By the way, this form response is necessary due to the large number of emails and other messages I have received.
Bests, Councilmember Jim Graham
Thanks, Ben.
For all this talk about bands loving to play in front of DC's all-ages crowds, I've been awfully annoyed recently at how many bands seem to be skipping DC on their tours. A lot seem to go straight from Charlottesville to Baltimore or Philly.
This has nothing to do with this argument, I just felt like complaining.
DC is a festering sewer.
If you didn't have to work here why would you come here?
Why not lower the drinking age to 16 in DC? Problem solved. If we are worried about drinking and driving, raising the driving age to 18 or 21 (or 32 for all I care). Kids are much more likely to kill or be killed driving around (sober or drunk) than they are likely to be killed or injured from drinking.
If I had to bet, I'd say the real issue people have with most of these "all ages" venues is not really drinking 16 year olds, but that drunk or sober 14-21 year olds are loud and irritating at 2am (and at 3pm). And, they tend to get into other unsavory activities when out in groups -- petty vandalism/harassing passers-by/littering etc (just walk by Cardozo at 3:30 pm when school gets out...).
I have to ask, because his reasoning for these bans is the recent death of a 17 year old in a nightclub by gun shot, why is the answer to these problems to ban minors and not ban guns... get rid of guns in DC! problem solved. On another note, the DC music scene is probably the biggest thing in my life, as a musician and teen i can honestly say this ban would be detramental to everything we as cultured youth have created in this city.
there is a handgun ban in d.c., and as for a live music venue vs. a nightclub, I believe there was a band playing at that club.
Me and my friends drove up to D.C. all the time for shows when we were young, and so I was bummed when I went to college somewhere else and found I couldn't go to shows with my friends because I was 17. Even worse, there were some clubs I couldn't get into at all in college because I was considered underage- well I didn't turn 21 till after graduation! I guess that's what you get for being precocious.
Anyway, I've been seeing live music in DC since I guess... 1993 and I've never been shot once. Most of us haven't. I think the ban is ridiculous and I feel sad for the kids who are not going to have a word in it. Then again, I feel sorry for anyone who is forced to go to s*** a** schools, s*** a** libraries, live in danger of violence and not only have no say in government where it takes a g** d*** act of congress to get anything done... even if their parents had a vote in congress, which they don't! I guess they just have to be grateful for Ft. Reno and a pretty okay metro, cause that's all they're getting here!
amazing article...
this information must be shared
I will post something on my blog
and
I am about to email Jim Graham directly
it seems as if people are blurring two separate issues
thanks again for sharing this infromation
-zilla
www.gwadzilla.blogspot.com
Seems pretty clear to me. Put under aged kids in a drinking environment, and the likelihood of their drinking goes way up.
Trust teenagers and their friends to police themselves? Sure, along with teen pregnancy and drugs. Just hand it over to those most hurt by it. How can a responsible, elected official think that this is good for their constituents?
Hey DC peeps, you need to throw the politicians like Graham out of office. We went through this in Seattle and the only way to deal with it is to organize the community and get involved in local politics. Raise money for council candidates who support all ages shows, support council campaigns, and get music fans out to vote. You can read about what happened in Seattle here - http://www.google.com/custom?sitesearch=thestranger.com&domains=thestranger.com&q=teen+dance+ordinance.
We ultimately threw all of the anti-all ages people out of office and helped elect a mayor, who is fucked in any ways, but still defends all ages shows. The city also helped fund an all ages venue , The Vera Project - www.theveraproject.org
Get ready for a long fight. It took us 10 years but the scene is much better off for our efforts. Good luck, we're rooting for you here. Let us know if we can help in any way. I have already written your council.
Hey DC peeps, you need to through the bums like Graham out of office. We went through this in Seattle and the only way to deal with it is to organize the community and get involved in local politics. Raise money for council candidates, support council campaigns, and get music fans out to vote. You can read about what happened in Seattle here - http://www.google.com/custom?sitesearch=thestranger.com&domains=thestranger.com&q=teen+dance+ordinance.
We ultimately threw all of the anti-all ages people out of office and helped elect a mayor, who is fucked in any ways, but still defends all ages shows. The city also helped fund an all ages venue , The Vera Project - www.theveraproject.org
Get ready for a long fight. It took us 10 years but the scene is much better off for our efforts. Good luck, we're rooting for you here. Let us know if we can help in any way. I have already written your council.
Hey DC peeps, you need to through the bums like Graham out of office. We went through this in Seattle and the only way to deal with it is to organize the community and get involved in local politics. Raise money for council candidates, support council campaigns, and get music fans out to vote. You can read about what happened in Seattle by doing a google search for "teen dance ordinance Seattle"
We ultimately threw all of the anti-all ages people out of office and helped elect a mayor, who is fucked in any ways, but still defends all ages shows. The city also helped fund an all ages venue , The Vera Project - theveraproject (dot) org
Get ready for a long fight. It took us 10 years but the scene is much better off for our efforts. Good luck, we're rooting for you here. Let us know if we can help in any way. I have already written your council.
now heres a thought we minors arent really alowed to do much atol these days do to strict laws and rules. now and days an adult can up to a kid who drinks, smokes and has casual sex and they could ask "hey why did you decide to do this". I guarentee they will say "well i was bored and it looked like fun". well that makes me think if this ban on all age shows goes through than were gonna have alot more kids smoking drinking and having casual sex. for one thing the whole banning of minors makes no sense but also its common sense that taking one more fun, positive, and safe activity from minors is just going to take them down a path of boredom and maybe give them thoughts of trying marijuana, cigarettes, alchohal or other crazy shit and that isnt good atol. i live in orlando florida and the punk/hardcore scene downhere is a joke. You will probably find 10 maybe 20 kids that are true straight edge and the rest are either sellouts or just never were edge and its extremely difficult for anybody to stay edge down here. 5 or 10 years ago the area was great it had plenty of venues and a decent punk/hardcore scene and alot of excellent bands. but now there are very little venues, like before there was atleast 10 maybe 15 venues now all we have is uncle lous, backbooth, the social, the dungeon, firestone and a bunch of bars that rarely host shows and alot of the venues ive mentioned are only doing 18&up shows until summer it sucks. also we have stupid kids down here that fuck up shit for the rest of us. one night after a good show at lake mary pub a couple of kids who were drunk from the time they showed up at the pub till the time they left ended up wanting to vandalize a car so they did. well about two hours after they did so a cop came out going "who did this to my car" yup it was his personal car and lake mary pub got sued and fined and the original manager lost his job there because of it and he had to pay all of the fines. pretty messed up right so what i want to say is, is that D.C's scene is a very valuable thing and its basically the scene that started it all and to watch it disappear do to a ban on all age shows would be a damn shame.
P.S. This is what i have to say to the man who brought the gun in the venue and to any future idiots who think about doing the same shit
GET FUCKED FAGGOT