August 6, 2007
Metro Considering Nixing Late Night Service
Metro General Manager John Catoe is considering replacing late night weekend trains with buses -- both as a way to save money and to create more time to complete track and station maintenance tasks. This is very bad news.
No one could argue that Metro needs to rethink how it accomplishes maintenance tasks -- the number of weekend track work delays, regular elevator and escalator outages, and out of service trains that need repairs has been out of hand for some time. Neither could anyone argue that Catoe isn't doing exactly what he was hired to do, which is figure out how to make Metro financially solvent. But late night Metro service, which runs from midnight to 3 a.m. on Friday and Saturday nights and has been around for less than a decade, is not a feature of Metro that should be considered when trying to find solutions to either of those problems.
Late night metro service on the weekends reduces the amount of drunk drivers on the road. Getting rid of after midnight service isn't going to stop many people from going out to bars on the weekends -- it's only going to change how they get home. Responsible people will turn to cabs, but countless others will try to drive home even though they've had one too many. Alternative bus options don't seem likely to change this outcome significantly. For better or for worse, late night buses have a stigma of being less safe attached to them, especially among people who come into the city to drink from Virginia and Maryland and are less familiar with bus schedules and routes. It would take a serious marketing campaign to convince weekend party kids to start busing home, and even then, we'd have our doubts that it would work.
Photo by carolyn k.
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Terrible, Terrible idea.
Metro is already well on their way to this. I stayed in DC for dinner and drinks on Cap Hill recently and headed to the Eastern Market Metro around 10 pm. I had to wait 15 minutes for the next train to come through the station. I can repeat this story over and over when referring to Rosslyn as well. And that's only two stations on the system.
I know that adding more trains during the twilight hours is probably not fiscally feasible. But this issue of massive times between trains is yet another reason why I'm leaning further towards driving in and out of DC everyday now.
Story broken here: http://theeagleblog.wordpress.com/2007/08/06/goodbye-to-late-night-weekend-metro-service/
This is horrible news for anyone who enjoys DC's nightlife ... we must protest this action
This is the worst idea ever. As much as Catoe loves buses, NOBODY is going to wait for a bus and deal with transfers to get back home.
This is a horrible idea!
This is a terrible idea. Metro weekend service already sucks. If you've ever tried to take the Metro from the Green line to the Red line on a Saturday night, you've already enjoyed waiting 15 minutes for a train, then 15 minutes for a connection, then walking, etc.
The track work delays and outages are because of the extended weekend and earlier weekday hours. Both significantly cut into maintenance schedules, and it shows in the regular outages.
Who gets wasted and rides a bus? Do people buy rounds for strangers and then say, "Hey, baby. Why don't we take the X3 back to my place and I can show you my etchings?" Good luck getting laid using that one, cowboy. One wrong move and you're on the 96 bus to Capitol Heights. That'll sober your ass up real quick.
Why close the whole system, why not close underused stations at late night hours? Do we really need Federal Center open past 8pm, or Archives when Gallery Place is just a few blocks north, Braddock Rd when King St is a few blocks to the south....ect. If we cut out these stations not only will it save money it will also speed up service.
Complain here ... http://www.wmata.com/riding/ridercomment.cfm
Anyone have John C's email address (or the one his admin gets?)
Metro stations always feel a little safer to me late at night than do bus stops (whether or not they're actually safer, I don't know). When I'm in a metro station, I can see exactly when the next train is coming, and be reasonably confident that it will show up as expected. Bus stops are more of a crapshoot. Sometimes a scheduled bus just doesn't show up, for whatever reason. Sometimes they're early, or late, or two buses on the same line will arrive simultaneously. Waiting at the bus stop after an evening on U Street or in Adams Morgan also means dealing with the catcalls of drunk passengers in passing cars.
Bad Catoe.
Bad, BAD Catoe.
No yippee-biscuit for bad, bad Catoe.
This will hurt DC's tax revenue. As a Virginian, I would spend less time and money in DC.
They could easily charge more money late night. Minimum $3.00 after midnight.
This is a terrible idea, but if you read the Post story it is clear that this is only one thing that is being considered (informally at that) and Jim Graham has already stated that this would be "dead in the water" should it actually be proposed.
I'd be willing to bet they don't completely eliminate the service but cut it back to around 2 a.m. I got the impression from the Post story that most of the passenger load comes before then.
I'd also respectfully disagree with twitch. Metro's late night schedule is pretty much in line with any other subway system I've been on. Just take the numbers from the Post article. Late night service accounts for about 3 pct of the system's total passengers. Doesn't really make sense to run the trains much more frequently.
I cry conspiracy! DC's jilted, money-grubbing cabbies have banded together to push Metro rail out of the late night picture.
Perhaps it's time to start biking everywhere. Or to move to a city with sane transportation management.
I don't trust a bus enough to take it on the weekends. Bus routes are almost always more sporadic than metro trains, especially if theyre doing this to save money. So figure at least 20-30 minutes in between buses. With the inevitable no-show that could be almost an hour. No way, I'd definitely just cab it.
wow. great way to make DC less of a real city than it already is.
guest [16]
Oh yeah, there's a solution: drunken bicycling at 3 AM.
I don't do metro in the evenings anymore. It just takes too long due to transfers. Driving to/from DC is not really that difficult. There is plenty of parking actually, it's just not distributed, and more often than not, private parking in office buildings. Even around busy night spots like Dupont circle, there is a lot of parking that is underutilized. And downtown/K is largely vacant, with tons of empty garages, just none of them public.
Dear Student Journalist (a.k.a., Guest 3): Publishing the same information a few minutes earlier on your own blog does not constitute "breaking" the story, especially when the source of your info is a television news report.
I love the idea that late night Metro service should simply be "off the table" when considering possible cost savings, though. Even if the service is under-utilized, and costs vastly more than the revenue it brings in? Even if the alternative is raising fares?
Personally I'd like to see some statistics on changes in late night bar revenue before and after the initiation of the late night service, and a side by side comparison of how much a change in the service might cost local businesses in relation to the cost of keeping Metro open each additional hour.
As a woman who often takes metro home alone late at night, this is a horrible, horrible idea. I am not okay with the idea of standing around at 2 in the morning on the street waiting for a bus that may or may not show up. At least with metro, you know there will be a train eventually and there are a lot less variables. If some skeezy drunk guy starts hey baby-ing you, you can at least pretend to get off at the next stop and change cars. That's not an option on the bus.
Plus, I live in Virginia. How the hell would I get from downtown DC to my house near King Street via the bus? I work in the non-profit sector and simply cannot afford the cabfare home after a night out... which means I wouldn't go out at all, which means that DC loses income. On the bright side, I'd save money and could enjoy some riveting late night cable. Trading Spaces, anyone?
#13 Has an interesting counter-proposal- charging a premium for late night service.
Metro already charges a premium for increased capacity during rush, right? Well, why not also do this for maintaining some capacity during the late late hours? Arguably, the late late hours are less important to Metro's operational model than serving the rush crowd, and so charging a bit more makes even more sense.
Is Metro going to get that dedicated tax source from DC/MD/VA anytime soon?
Also, I don't think many of you take the bus on a regular basis. I take it a lot, including late at night, and I have never had any problems. In fact, very late at night (1 am and later) is when the buses tend to be their most reliable. Metro should still stay open later, though.
Anyone else getting terribly annoyed with the "DC Sucks" posts? I am. Honestly guest18, if you don't like it here, go away.
Is metro perfect? No and we shouldn't stand for mediocrity, but be happy that you have a system like this. Ever been to a city that just has buses? Try getting around and see how
terrible, awful, horrible idea.
People above have listed a lot of ways to cut costs without cutting service that I would agree to:
- reducing the number of metro stations open that late
-increasing late-night fares (even if they double it, it's still cheaper than taking a cab)
-cutting closing time to 2 instead of 3.
remember, it was just a couple years ago that metro ended late-night service on thursdays
I think Metro's officials have been replaced with assorted zoo animals.
Frankly, this wouldn't affect me at all. I always take cabs anyway. My only concern is that it would keep people out of the city, or worse, bring more cars into the city.
Do people actually take buses to and from bars? Even when I suffered an entry-level salary I'd take a cab both ways.
As someone mentioned above, Graham and the rest of the Council will never let this happen. Jim doesn't want more cars fighting for parking in Adams Morgan.
Whenever I'm on the Red Line late at night, the train seems pretty crowded; it's obviously a popular service on Friday & Saturday. If metro charged each rider an extra buck or two after 10:00 PM, that might help. And honestly, who's going to notice an extra dollar on the smart trip card after paying for several $6 beers?
I actually think this is a great idea! Metro will finally be able to repair the tracks so that there won't be 1/2 hour delays on Monday mornings as I take the metro in from Shady Grove.
DC Residents - If you don't like how metro operates, move or start your own train system! Stop whining!
Cabs aren't exactly safe either. I've been sexually assualted by a cab driver and my cousin was attacked by one.
I always thought it was bad enough that the metro stops its service at the exact moment most bars close (so people who lose track of time and stay until last call can't take it), and the trains come so infrequently that most people would rather risk driving than have it take 5 times as long to get home.
I think this could hurt people who work late hours -- these jobs tend to be low-paying so they can't afford a car or to take a cab home every night.
Guest30:
"DC Residents - If you don't like how metro operates, move or start your own train system! Stop whining!"
How about this: Maryland residents - Get a job in your own state, get your state to adequately fund Metro, or stay off of our trains.
Sound ridiculous? It still makes more sense than your assinine comment.
DC Residents - If you don't like how metro operates, move or start your own train system! Stop whining!
Also, isn't it more likely to be MD and DC residents who rely on the late-night trains? DC residents are probably more likely to bus/cab/walk.
I like the logic though. Next time I hear someone from VA complain about traffic, I'll tell them to move or build their own road system.
For the record, I believe the proposal was actually to have buses "follow" the metro lines (per the original WAPO story). With that being said, when my night of hard partying at PG Plaza or Benning Road is over, I would much rather take a train home than a bus.
I'm pretty sure that Metro DOES charge extra for the late night rides....they charge the same for post midnight rides as they do for rush hour trips.
@36: Only between 2-3 am, IIRC.
If you can't walk to the bar, you shouldn't be in it. Screw MD, VA, Tenleytown, Brookland, Van Ness, etc. Ward One represent.
Any change that contributes to increased drinking and driving is an error, regardless of costs.
It would also save money to tear down all the stop lights and road signs in the city, and let drivers use their own judgment to decide when it is safe to proceed. But that would be stupid too.
This is a really bad idea. I will be happy to participate in any protest, as another poster suggested—we could stand on the right during rush-hour, for example.
Is Metro going to get that dedicated tax source from DC/MD/VA anytime soon?
Don't know what the status of dedicated funding is in MD, but NVTA just authorized $300 million in tax increases for transportation funding, including Metro. On Thursday the Davis bill was headed to the full Senate:
http://www.wtopnews.com/index.php?nid=25&sid=1207481
For all you people complaining about waiting for 15 minutes to get a train at night (honestly, 15 minutes!?) you can expect the same wait on pretty much any other subway system in this country, NY's and Chicago's included.
Shit, 15 minutes is commonplace in the middle of the afternoon on a Saturday. It's those 30 minute waits that will getcha. But it's true - such long waits are not particular to WMATA.
If they funded METRO with congestion fees, they could expand service, and run it FARE-FREE.
Cutting back service??? Stupidest Idea Ever! The metro should be running 24-7 like it does not only in NYC, but many less weathy cities than D.C. around the world. The ridership is going down because they keep raising the fares, which are already much higher than comparative rail systems.
We're going to ride a Bus or a Bicycle home from the BAR??? Get real. Who does that? Nobody.
Instead of blowing all their money on pavement and parking for cars (let alone Stadium Boondogles and corporate welfare), they cold spend a small fraction of that on rail and cycling facilities, and most people wouldn't need their cars at all. This has been show many times, many places. When will they learn?
Pay $$$ to park. Pay $$$ to drive.
Ride rail for FREE... 24-7.
NO! oh god no! bus service is AWFUL AND SLOW. Once after a show at the warner theatre, we walked to 14th to take the bus north. we waited at least 45 minutes for the bus to show, then it took another 45-60 minutes to get to our stop. the bus service in dc is so awful that I'm looking into getting a car because it's so insanely slow and inefficient. This past weekend, I went to borders downtown and decided to take the bus home rather than the metro (live in columbia heights)... again, it ended up taking about two hours to get home (3 miles away from borders).