October 16, 2007
Could D.C. United Head to Maryland?
The Post's David Nakamura says some Maryland officials would like to lure D.C. United across the border. Maryland Comptroller Peter Franchot, noting the derailed talks between D.C. Mayor Adrian Fenty and D.C. United owner Victor MacFarlane, wrote a letter to the Maryland Stadium Authority asking them to look at snagging United for themselves.
"In the wake of these developments, I would strongly urge the Maryland Stadium Authority to meet with representatives from the United to learn more about its proposal and explore potential opportunities to bring this great franchise to the State of Maryland," Franchot wrote. "If an ideal site could be found and a development agreement reached with the franchise, this project could yield enormous benefits for our State."Should a deal between D.C. United and Maryland begin to be explored, surely Ward 8 Council member Marion Barry will be vocal about how Fenty's unwillingness to bend on his financial plans for Poplar Point let the team slip away from the District. Then again, we've heard reports about United leaving the District before. Still, this kind of interest in negotiating from the Comptroller must be a welcome sign to MacFarlane, who has been rather public about his disappointment with Fenty.
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I know I am going to get bashed for this but seriously who cares for soccer?
Also, unless the team is willing to play in an existing stadium in DC then I see no reason to use taxpayer funds to build a new one. I don't want another indirect tax on DC citizens so that some rich a-hole can have a free stadium built.
MS:
1. You'd be surprised by DC United's attendance numbers.
2. RFK is not financially viable in the long-term.
3. DC isn't paying for the stadium. The rich a-hole will be doing that, just in exchange for the right to develop the surrounding area.
"just in exchange for the right to develop the surrounding area."
Aye, there's the rub. From an economical perspective giving those development rights away in exchange for a stadium is not a whole lot different than just paying for the stadium. I really would like to see the Poplar Point Stadium come through, but I'm glad Fenty is putting it out for open bidding. If McFarlaine's offer is so good, then it can withstand some competition.
"If McFarlaine's offer is so good, then it can withstand some competition."
Except that the competition set up by Fenty prevents MacFarlane from making his offer, because it limits development to 4 million square feet, while MacFarlane's proposal is for 8 million square feet; it seems unlikely that this was an accident.
Bring on PG United. Ward 9 continues to benefit at the expense of Ward 8.
"If McFarlaine's offer is so good, then it can withstand some competition."
I agree. I'm just fearing that everything will get out of control and overly complex like it always does in DC. Then nothing will end up getting picked, and the site will be barren for another decade.
I just can't really see any other proposal that could actually work, regardless of the money involved. The reason no one's developed the site in all these years (besides the fact DC doesn't actually own the land) is that it's an area that a large part of the DC (white people) would never really consider visiting that particular area.
Having a soccer stadium could at least entice people to make their first visit to that part of town. After not getting shot in the face like they were expecting, they might be more willing to return for the other businesses/bars/restaurants that would be part of the developed area. Just my two cents...
"in exchange for the right to develop the surrounding area."
And then the city will have to develop the infrastructure for 20,000 extra people to cross the river at the same time, most in cars because there is no way soccer supporters are going to walk a half-mile to the Anacostia Metro after games. Unlike JFK, Poplar point has no Metro station of its own.
"there is no way soccer supporters are going to walk a half-mile to the Anacostia Metro after games"
Didn't you already get shot down after making the same stupid comment on Fisher's blog?
The United ownership is responsible for Poplar Point being on the radar and available in the first place. It has spent years and dollars creating good will and promises to the community. All this under the Williams administration.
Fenty pledged at a United game to make this happen. United ownership wants to spend $1 Billion to develop this area, with the understanding that the city would spend $350 Million moving water mains, helicopter pads and other items that any developer will require to make the area accessible.
Macfarlane has been acting in good faith and is spending his money to make it happen. He and United ownership (and fans) do not deserve to be treated like this.
Why does the Maryland Stadium Authority think it is a great deal when the Fenty Administration does not?
Um, giving development rights is NOT the same as buying a stadium if the land is worthless until there is a draw there (like a stadium) in the first place. If the land is so valuable and waiting to be developed, why are we still sitting here having this discussion and not enjoying the fine shopping and nightlife across the river?
"If the land is so valuable and waiting to be developed, why are we still sitting here having this discussion and not enjoying the fine shopping and nightlife across the river?"
Because the federal government owns the land.
I am certain that if they built waterfront condos, without a stadium, it would still be a huge success.
The land is hardly worthless in the absence of a stadium. Look at National Harbor, they seem to think that development will work in the absence of a sports stadium.
There's a reason why MacFarlane is willing to pay for a stadium in exchange for the development rights: because they're incredibly valuable. The city is completely within its right mind to consider whether giving up those development rights in exchange for a soccer stadium is a good disposition of an asset (an asset, I repeat, that isn't even in DC's hands yet). And it's completely reasonable for the city to set aside a portion of that land to keep as open-space; even if that doesn't fit in MacFarlane's balance sheet.
Why does the Maryland Stadium Authority think it is a great deal when the Fenty Administration does not?
Because the Fenty administration is incompetent and shortsighted. A new futbol stadium at Poplar Point has the potential to act as a catalyst for development, as others have said above, not only to attract mostly-white soccer fans to the side of the river that most of them think is a wild jungle full of scary monsters, but to spur economic development that provides opportunities for east-of-the-river residents.
As a councilman, Fenty was against the baseball stadium all along, and it doesn't surprise me that his shortsightedness continues.
Why don't they just play in the Maryland Redskins stadium?
If all it took was to build condos there, you'd think with the thousands of condos that went up in DC over the last five years, someone would have put some there, eh? The land is worth very little until you put some big draws there. Who will move into a condo on the water in a wasteland?
"In the wake of these developments, I would strongly urge the Maryland Stadium Authority to meet with representatives from the United to learn more about its proposal and explore potential opportunities to bring this great franchise to the State of Maryland," Franchot wrote.
They are never going to get the team in Maryland by referring to it as "the United." Every press release United sends out says very clearly at the bottom, "Broadcasting and P.A. Request: When speaking of the organization, please refer to the team as either “D.C. United” or “United,” but not “the D.C. United” or “the United.” We appreciate your cooperation."
I don't want the team to move to the Maryland, they belong in DC, but if Maryland really wants them, they should at least learn what to call them.
"you'd think with the thousands of condos that went up in DC over the last five years, someone would have put some there, eh?"
You'd think, that is, until you'd remember that the land is still owned by the Federal government.
If this is such a wasteland, I don't see how a huge stadium, that will be empty over 300 nights a year, would make a difference. A residential/commerical district there will have to stand mostly on its own, which I don't think would be a problem.
Reid:
Didn't the McFarlane plan set aside some space for green space?
And it's not like there isn't green space here already. The large waterfront parks East of the River aren't exactly overused as it is.
How does a soccer stadium fit in with the overall Anacostia Waterfront Development Project? I thought the idea was to have mixed development/residence/greenspace from New York Avenue past RFK around the baseball stadium and up to the Tidal Basin. Or is this a separate kettle of fish, and the usual DC development circle jerk where the right hand doesn't know who the left hand is giving a reacharound to?
And if they do plop a stadium there, I hope they have the good sense not to dole out any more exclusive 99-year leases that cost taxpayers millions to get out of.
While the smell is off the rose for me, as far as Adrian Fenty as Mayor is concerned, I hope on this Poplar Point development plan, he has the stones to say NO to Victory MacFarlane IF, his deal to develop Poplar Point is not the best or in the ballpark of the other potential developers.
First, MacFarlane showed his "card" way back when he bought the operating rights to DC United when he announced that it wasn't really the team or stadium that most interested him, it was the ability to develop Poplar Point, which he was trying to get for a undervalued amount. Don't get fooled by that offer to pay for the stadium. What he stood to make as developer of that parcel of land would make the amount of building the stadium just a small drop in the bucket.
To be very frank, had MacFarlane NOT been Black, and had Brian Davis, one of the minority partners(as in small, not racial) in United's ownership group not been a relative of Councilchairman Vincent Gray, you would have had NO DC leadership pushing for the soccer stadium at Poplar Point. Ward 8 Councilmember Marion Barry, a champion of soccer stadium at Poplar Point project NOW, was at one time, when the ownership was made up of a different group, one of its staunchest critics. What flipped his and others support of the project now? Nothing changed other than MacFarlane, former Olympic Gymnast Jair Lynch, and former Duke basketball player Davis.
For what its worth, I am a soccer fan, live less than a mile from Poplar Point, and I would like the team to stay in the city boundary, but at the end of the day, the only thing "Major League" about Major League Soccer is its name. Its a league that is on par with AA baseball to Major League baseball, or 1-AA football compared to Division 1-A college football. Its a league with teams worth following, but not a league with teams that you break the bank to give incentives to stay or even build a stadium for like you would a NFL, NBA, or MLB team. Its not going to draw those kinds of numbers like a NFL team would draw on a weekly basis, or what a basketball or baseball team would draw over a 41-81 game season. If I was Mayor Fenty, the parking lot across the grassy median from the Armory, would be the spot I would give DC United to build its stadium. Its footprint is the size for the 25,000 seat stadium DC United wants, and all the infrastructure is already in place regarding transportation and parking, something that was and is a BIG problem at the place they put the new Nationals Stadium. Poplar Point, directly across the river from the Nationals Stadium should be, in my view, developed with residential and retail and parkland in mind. To put a stadium at that site I think is a waste of the land.
As for Maryland now wanting to find a spot for DC United, good luck. One of the things that helps DC United in its attendance, best in MLS, is its location of being in the city and on a Metro stop. They won't draw nearly as many fans 20 to 30 miles away from the city which is really the only places in Maryland, and northern Virginia that has a cheap enough parcel of land that would make United building its own stadium affordable. Nobody's going to go watch the team on a regular basis if they play in Germantown, MD, or out in the Dulles Airport corridor. Just like we found early in the Expos, now Nationals flirt to move here, those are the only places that halfway could stomach the thought of a stadium in its back yard.
Fenty, I just thanked you for the cabbie thing. Don't make me take them back. The skins are already in Maryland, don't let the United go there too!
"Why don't they just play in the Maryland Redskins stadium?"
A soccer pitch is larger than a football gridiron, and since so many seats have been crammed in around the field at FedEx in recent years, there is no longer the space to host soccer games.
One premise worth correcting here. DC United never expected to be "given" development rights without compensation. They expected to pay for the land. Victor MacFarlane claimed he would be paying "fair market value." It's possible that's not true, but the Fenty administration never (publicly) disputed it.
What they did instead was:
A) reduce the amount of land from the 150 acres United had been given to work with in the Williams plan down to 40, and
B) Declare DC United unqualified to bid.
Here's a FAQ from the team:
http://dcunited.mlsnet.com/t103/stadium/poplar_point/
Another thing that seems to be overlooked here is the fact that without Victor MacFarlane's push, the District would never be in the position to accept competitive bids on Poplar Point. The Williams administration asked and encouraged MacFarlane to work the feds in order to get the land. And as soon as the hard work is done, the new administration says whoops, fingers crossed, kthxbai. If this happened in any other context, many people who don't understand what a following the beautiful game has in this city would be calling it a despicable double-cross of the highest magnitude - "Thanks for getting us the land. Have fun playing your silly little sport elsewhere."