WTOP Report Provokes Anger Among Area Cyclists
Goodbye Fixie, Hello Tweed!
Committee Approves Same-Sex Marriage Bill
Burger-pocalypse at BGR
D.C. Area Pedestrian Safety Could Be Worse
The Examiner's Michael Neibauer came up with an interesting story by talking to MPD officer David Baker. Baker posted a frustrated screed earlier this month on the 2nd District police email list, after yet another person was struck by a car at the intersection of Nebraska and Connecticut Avenues NW. Baker believes that the increase in pedestrian accidents in the area is not only due to drivers not paying attention—the pedestrians themselves are largely to blame, thanks to them being distracted by iPods and cell phones.
Now, surely it's true that there's been a huge spike over the last several years in the number of pedestrians who wear headphones while they walk around the city. But I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that 85-year-old Charles Schwartz and 64-year-old Gloria Nahid, the last two people who were killed by vehicles at that intersection, probably weren't part of the iPod culture that officer Baker is railing against here. Could we all pay more attention while crossing the street? Absolutely. But the intersection of Nebraska and Connecticut Avenues NW is a particularly dangerous one whether you're wearing headphones or not.
add to stumble upon
add to reddit
tweet this
post to facebook
I have serious trouble driving down 13th or 14th Street within 3 blocks of U street without very nearly knocking the sense of entitlement right out of a pedestrian or two. Not a lot of crosswalk-using or light-respecting going on there.
Who gets to knock the sense of entitlement out of you?
I thought we all agreed that the cars-vs-pedestrians argument was about as pointless as the Mac-vs-PC argument, and it is in fact the bicyclists who are the worst violators of all rules of man and nature?
Anyway, the problem is that people think a driver's license is a god-given right enshrined in the Constitution, when clearly many people shouldn't even be unchained from the sunken well in the basement, let alone allowed behind the wheel of a two-ton automobile. But try telling that to John and Jane Sixpack who are f**king sick of driving little Snotley around from soccer practice to band practice to loiter practice behind the dumpsters at the 'Sev. The sooner that punk is out of their hair, the sooner they can get back to having torrid affairs with their raquetball coaches, their personal chefs, and their cringing pets. So Snotley fails the multiple choice, kills three students in the parallel parking exam, and he gets his license ANYWAY because we don't want to piss off THE ELECTORATE. Then he grows up to be Snotley Senior, Senile Batfart and All-around 30MPH under the speed limit jackass who's legally blind and yet HE STILL DRIVES ANYWAY because we don't want to be seen as hating on our precious seniors, because they are our future. Teach them well and let them lead the way by LOOKING TO THE LEFT AS THEY MAKE A RIGHT TURN RIGHT INTO YOU.
As for so-called "pedestrians" where the HELL do you people think you get off walking around? Hello? It's called a recession, you need to be driving your car to the end of your driveway to get your goddamned MAIL. Why do you think we're paying GM billions of dollars to fire 50,000 employees? So next time when you're jaywalking and rockin out to Foghat or Deep Purple or whatever the younger people are listening to, and texting your bitches, AND faxing your order to Chipotle for your Chicken Bol from your combination Bluetooth headset/haircut/dildo sharpener, ask yourself, "Shouldn't I be doing this from inside the luxurious interior of a Nissan Apocalypse®?" And then smash yourself through the nearest windshield.
This is one of your better unhinged rants.
DC doesn't have a parallel parking segment on the exam. Actually, they don't have you park at all. Or do much of anything, really.
Circa 1995, DC had a driving in traffic portion of the exam. I'd let mine expire since I didn't have a car, so I signed up, took the written, and distinctly recall waiting with a half dozen teenagers and some old dude in the parking lot off Brentwood. Each person would get into the car with the instructor, exit the lot, drive around to an intersection, make a u turn, return. Of the 7 people taking the exam, the first three failed: they didn't come to a complete stop at the stop sign at the parking lot exit.
My only consolation is that most of the drivers that day are either dead or in prison.
Is there a light at this intersection? If not then it is obvious that the pedestrian had the right of way. I have no sympathy, though, for pedestrians who cross against the light and get hit. Getting hit is the same risk I take if I run a red light in my car, and its even more ridiculous to take that chance on foot.
My personal favorite, crossing against the light while pushing baby in his stroller.
Maybe they were sitting on the ground to take a photo of the intersection?
I'd be curious as to what makes that intersection any more dangerous than the other intersections in DC? Though I will note that someone once ran right in front of my car there making me slam on the breaks--and yes, they had in headphones.
Of course, there are plenty of careless and aggressive pedestrians. But pedestrians are flesh and blood, and make mistakes. Drivers of one ton cars made of steel have a duty to anticipate and prepare for such mistakes, and avoid injury. Part of driving is ensuring is defensively preventing injuring to anything or anyone else.
It is also the responsibility of pedestrians to make themselves visible to vehicles. Placing the bulk of the responsibilty is only fair if pedestrians always obeyed traffic laws and we know that does not happen.
if you're crossing outside of a crosswalk, you're putting your life at risk, for sure.
but the people you cited from connecticut ave. were killed in crosswalks, no?
fact is that we could all stand to pay more attention, but playing some kind of "blame the victim" game is in really poor taste, especially coming from a police officer. makes him look like a real grade-a jackass.
The problem is everyone. The sense of entitlement among both drivers, pedestrians and cyclists creates a pretty dangerous situation.
Pedestrians need to use the crosswalks, tho our city doesn't do an adequate job of marking them.
Drivers need to yield. Growing up here i know this is a foreign concept, but in other parts of the country people actually yield to pedestrians. The tug of war goes a lot smoother when all parties play by the rules...
This city is still too full of self-important idiots talking on their crackberries and making illegal turns in their S500 for me to ever consider riding a bike downtown.
I know it's a pipe dream here, but if anyone has ever been to the Pacific NW, it's amazing how smoothly things run when drivers, pedestrians and cyclists all respect the traffic rules.
So true. I was born and raised in the district, so I thought it was normal for cars to careen around corners and honk if someone was in their way, yielding was a foreign and quaint tradition.
Then I lived in Portland for two years, and saw that everyone actually coexists, drivers wave and apologize if they get too close to your bike, honking is almost a social taboo, and yielding is the norm. My first month there my car was swarmed by a mob of pedestrian zombies and humiliated for pulling too far into a crosswalk, steep learning curve. Of course people still get killed in crosswalks and on bikes there too- so go figure.
I have to say I had one experience in VA where a woman in a Jag decided to get pissy when she had to stop and let us legally cross the street while she wanted to turn. She then slammed on the gas and nearly ran us over. I turned around and there was a police cruiser on a nearby corner. I said, "Did you see that? She nearly ran us over. You should go give her a ticket." Officer nods, gets in his car, turns on the lights and pulls her over a few hundred feet down the road.
I nearly fell over. Arlington's finest have been an absolute pleasure compared to cops in other jurisdictions.
i actually did get an MPD officer to make an attempt to catch a car that had run a red light and nearly run me over while bicycling home one day. he didn't catch the guy, but i appreciated the effort.
I was crossing Connecticut at Nebraska recently. Yes, I had my headphones in, but I was crossing with the light and had looked both ways when a Metrobus decided to run the red and almost mowed me down.
The problem with that intersection is that there are a lot of lights but also a lot of hills, so vehicles can build up speed and often don't stop for lights due to momentum and to being glad to get into less city-like traffic.
I drive. I also live on 24th between M and L and usually take the Metro from Foggy Bottom to and from work, which means everyday I
1) cross L street @ 24th, then
2) cross Penn @ 24th, then surviving THAT, I
3) cross that diagonal clusterfuck where 24th, New Hampshire and that mini me street cross
trust me: the city could raise alot of $ by installing red light cameras at points 1) and 2) and keeping a rush hour cop on perm at point 3). Or they could install a public beating stall where we could get a wack at some of those ass stains drivers who act like pedestrian safety comes last.
Washington Circle can be a mess when it comes to walking through the intersections. Everyday I see people step blindly out in front of traffic or run across to make it to the circle because they are in too much of a hurry to walk in the crosswalk or wait for the light. There is one section of Washington Circle that very few people stop at. People claim they don't understand the lights and so they just step out as traffic starts to turn. What is so difficult about looking straight ahead and see the little crosswalking sign. I just keep waiting for the day when someone gets wiped out because they were too clueless to notice that they don't have the right of way.
I also see pedistrians get very upset when a car honks at them because they don't have the right of way. It amazes me that people blindly walk in front of traffic and don't realize they are at fault.
I live at that diagonal clusterf*ck, so I both walk and drive through it pretty much daily. The intersection would benefit enormously from a little thoughtfulness and courtesy by all parties--the pedestrians never look up or pause before stepping into the street, and they frequently cross diagonally, and the cars just mow on through.
God help everyone if a truck is unloading at the 7-11.
There are definitely some distracted/oblivious pedestrians, but the number of aggressive/oblivious drivers far exceeds that of pedestrians. I see many more incidents where the drivers are fully at fault than I see pedestrians creating their own peril. This is especially true for cars turning at green lights but failing to yield right of way pedestrians crossing with a 'walk' sign.
Me, at 7:15pm on Friday evening, driving south on Connecticut Avenue from Jenifer Street to Calvert Street. I can't tell you how many people I encountered crossing mid-block with traffic zooming by them. Maybe 12 or less? It was ridiculous.
I believe that there are a lot of drivers out there who are distracted and careless. Ditto for these fearless pedestrians. It's a jungle out there!!!
I once got viscously yelled at by a driver for being in her way. I was on a sidewalk.
Apparently she thought that it was ok to speed out of an alley through a sidewalk in the middle of the Dupont Circle neighborhood in the middle of the evening commute a few blocks from Metro. Good thing I look down alleys before crossing them. She didn't even notice that she almost hit me until I knocked on her back window. The she started yelling and asking me if I ever thought I was in her way. I nicely told her that she could kill someone and that I was on a sidewalk... a place where people walk.
Hear, Hear!
The closest calls I have had are walking on the sidewalk. Mainly due to negligent drivers turning into or out of alleys, side streets, and parking garages at more than desirable speeds.
The other times it is usually when I have the light in the crosswalk. I had to make like Usain Bolt the other day on K and 11th when some oblivious idiot tried to make roadkill outta' me with his conversion van.
Don't you just love the I'm Sorry wave? Hallmark should jump on this.
I never accept the "I'm sorry wave", I normally remind them that they can kill someone. This isn't a "sorry I cut you off with my shopping cart in the grocery store" situation; it is "you almost killed someone" situation. This woman didn't even give the I'm sorry wave.. she yelled at me. She didn't even know enough to be scared.
I actually find the timid drivers to be the worst. You know, that person who slows down at the intersection even if its green which leads to a couple pedestrians running across then the driver speeds up causing a pedestrian to freeze in the street. Then timid Tammy slams on the brakes causing untold horrors behind her and the pedestrian runs back to the side walk and Tammy slowly creeps through the intersection as the light turns and the next 4 cars behind her speed up to make it. But oh no! Impatient Patrick is stuck in the intersection, blocking the box and short stop Steve is blocking the crosswalk so everything goes to hell all over again.
Give me congestion charges.
west: yeah, i find it strange every once in a while, when i'm perfectly happy waiting at a crosswalk for my turn, and a car with a green light just up and stops and starts waving me through.
first, it bugs me because not following the rules here leads to confusion.
secondly, there's almost always another lane that i can't see well because of this well-meaning person sitting around waving me on. no way in hell i'm taking advantage of your kindness/stupidity just to get nailed by a fedex truck flying through in the next lane.
IMGoph: Agreed. I NEVER let some idiot surrender their right-of-way with an inappropriate stop and a wave... The other cars have a reasonable expectation of predictability, and confusion results. Old people do this alot while grinning and drooling on the steering wheel clutched under their chins.
This discussion reminds me of a study that came out of UC Berkeley.
Despite complaints about pedestrians crossing when they're not supposed to, the study found that most accidents happen when pedestrians have the right of way. The reasoning is that when people jaywalk, they're more aware of their surroundings--they actively find gaps in traffic, look both ways, and hurry across the street. The study also found that people with children and the elderly (like in the last two pedestrian accidents) are more likely to use crosswalks but are the more vulnerable targets.
The bottom line is that most pedestrians do have the right of way when at a crosswalk and drivers must yield even if the walker isn't paying attention. Ultimately, the law reveals that it's is the driver's responsibility to be cautious at all times and especially when approaching crosswalks.
There are lots of great studies out there that show that traffic with less rules can be safer since people then pay much more attention, countries without hard crosswalk traditions for example. Since it is up to the pedestrian to find a gap, and up to the drivers to look around and stop. Otherwise people put it into drive and get back to reading DCist.
As a pedestrian I am totally guilty of not paying attention when I have the right of way and paying extra attention when I'm jaywalking. I've been hit once and had 5 exceptionally close calls, all while I was in a crosswalk with a walk signal, never once while I was jaywalking. You would think I would start paying attention when I have the right of way...
That intersection has a light, with signals for turning left. There's also red light cameras on Connecticut. I've seen people nearly get run over there a few times, and it was either because of a dumbass driver, a dumbass pedestrian, or a combination of a dumbass duo.
I disagree that the cop makes himself look dumb or careless for telling pedestrians to pay attention when crossing the streets. While no doubt there are lots of self-important drivers who can't be bothered by red lights and pedestrians in crosswalks, there are also lots of self-important pedestrians believing they have total right of invincibility when crossing the street (regardless of whether they're in a crosswalk or have the light to cross). And I won't even get into the bicyclists who want to be treated just like a car, except for having to obey traffic lights and signs.
Bottom line: People need to pay more attention and be less dumbasses.
There are not left turn signals in every direction at that intersection and I think that is part of the problem. Drivers trying to turn left from CT to Nebraska are focused at looking at the oncoming traffic. Once they see a hole there, they are going. Most of them haven't considered looking for pedestrians with the right of way in the cross walk because they're too busy looking at the incredible amount of traffic coming towards them.
That's how the woman got killed by the H8 bus on the corner of 16th and Park over a year ago. At extremely high traffic intersections where they are designed for no break in traffic, left turns should no be allowed. I know it makes it harder to get where you are trying to go, but it's worth it not to kill people. In the 16th and Park incident there is a left turn access road in front of the church there, but the bus is the only vehicle that is allowed to turn from 16th to Park without using it. The bus won't fit down that access road.
Sadly, it's the perfect example of drivers hurrying to get out of the way of oncoming traffic without considering the pedestrians that are beyond it, crossing with the cross light.
I think the problem is more general. Basically there are too many stupid people in the city. On any given day I see activity that would make Darwin cringe. I.e. several people crossing streets against the crosswalk, very often walking in front of moving traffic when the traffic has the right of way.
The problem is particularly bad at intersections where there is a turn arrow. Morons seem to think that as soon as the opposing light turns red, they can cross. They don't see to notice that vehicles turning on a GREEN turn arrow have the right-of-way.
This very morning I watched as one guy jaywalked across 17th street at Farragut Square, walking RIGHT in front of a MOVING BUS in the process. The bus had to slam on it's brakes. The driver and another passenger in the bus just looked on in disbelief. Really the pedestrian was just asking to be run over. And he would have been at fault.
There are plenty of dumbass drivers out there who can't be bothered to divert their gaze away from their blackberrys, and they should be punished. But there are also loads, and i mean LOADS of pedestrians who do not watch where they are going, and who walk carelessly into traffic.
In an ideal world, peds would only cross streets at crosswalks, and drivers would be penalized for blocking intersections and crosswalks. I think we should put up cameras that automatically issue $50 tickets to anyone who blocks an intersection or xwalk with their car. We could also be more proactive against jaywalkers, as in cities like Chicago.
This city/area is in dire need of an 'end stupidity' campaign, since most people living around here seem to be borderline 'developmentally disabled.'
I'd contribute to the "end stupidity" campaign, but I already have all my discretionary funds tied up in the "stop old people from buying crap at the grocery store with pennies" campaign, as well as the "buy everyone a bath because cologne/perfume ain't bathing" campaign.
I predict equal success for all these worthy measures.
I'm with you. Personally I can't stand people who wear obnoxious amounts of personal fragrances. I actually consider it a type of pollution. I should be able to ride a train without being assailed with some stinky smell. One of my co-workers uses this hand cream every day that very nearly makes me gag. It would be a lot easier to life with humans if said humans: 1) bathed every day and 2) didn't drown themselves in some stinky-ass toilet water.
Now if you'll excuse me, I need to go to the supermarket to buy a single piece of fruit, with a coupon, and then return it.
That intersection is particularly dangerous for pedestrians walking downhill on the left side of Nebraska attempting to cross Connecticut. Cars driving uphill on Nebraska turn right without yielding to pedestrians and often without signaling. Pedestrians have a walk signal. I run in that neighborhood a lot, and I've had to yell and smack the hoods of cars to avoid being hit at that spot.
Pedestrians definitely should get off the cell phones and take out the ear buds, but when they are attempting to cross at a crosswalk when they have a lit sign informing them that it is safe to cross, there is NO EXCUSE for drivers to cause a dangerous situation.
IMO, these drivers who hit pedestrians in such situations should be prosecuted for attempted homicide or actual homicide. There is no excuse. I love DC, but as a native of the Midwest, I was shocked at the careless way most people drive. I am a driver as well, and I know that pedestrians are often careless, traffic is heavy, and traffic lights tend to be out of sync. However, drivers MUST pay attention, especially at intersections.
The courts have long upheld that pedestrians deserve more protection and consideration than vehicles. The reason being that when a pedestrian disregards the rules, he/she is taking his OWN life in his hands. He/she is not likely to take someone else's life away from them. The driver of a vehicle is in a completely different situation. When a driver disregards the rules, he/she is most likely to take away someone else's life, especially a pedestrian before or in addition to their own.
Does this Baker guy even know under what conditions the pedestrians were killed, or is he just mouthing off about something he knows nothing about.
Sure, I've seen plenty of close calls because pedestrians were too busy enjoying their iPod, iPhone or CrackBerry. (here's a fun game to play at a busy intersection during rush hour. Take two or three steps off the curb and see how many of the 15 pedestrians next to or behind you follow without looking for cars themselves).
But, as others have said, there's probably plenty of blame to go around. What's the solution? Who knows? Better public education campaigns? Better licensing tests? Tasers?
guide bears. i want guide bears.
I watched 12 people at 15 & Irving almost get mowed down due to Corner Creep®
Such an easy to answer to this -- take a cue from the intersections further up Connecticut and install neon orange flags with STOP! printed on them for pedestrians to carry when crossing the streets. Seriously, that's the only neighborhood in DC where those things could be housed and not stolen. They're hilarious. But they do make me stop.
This is the freaking 21st century. Put a stop light over the intersection and a sensor so that as soon as a pedestrian steps onto the crosswalk, the light turns red. Or even easier, have a crosswalk button and make the pedestrian wait for a red light to come up, rather than granting a permanent right of way. The confusion comes when the rules are unclear. Put in a stop light system that works, and everything will be fine.
Interesting. As soon as someone steps in the crosswalk it goes straight to red. Sounds like a plan. Perhaps DC could award the contract to ACME.
If people actually drove slowly, and used their brakes, that might help. I think the average speed in my neighborhood is about 45, 40 if there are small children and dogs in the street. People particularly like to accelerate from 0 to 25 as quickly as possible- since that makes you get home faster I guess.
Some of these streets,avenues,and boulevards are so wide--and the pedestrian walk signals timed so unbelievably short--that my 86 year old mother cannot cross them before traffic bears down on her. I've experienced this with her time and again.
And at the intersection of Mass Ave and P Street on the east side of Dupont Circle, the "walk" signals--there at three of them there in that one small spot--are so badly timed that pedestrians make it across one section, only to find themselves massed on the tiny raised area and prohibited from finishing the cross.
Clearly, the pedestrians in DC are being forced, by ill-conceived and poorly planned crosswalk management, to suit the needs of the combustible engine, which does not make for a walkable, livable city (which should be our goal).
I bet 85 year old Charles was downloading the latest Benny Goodman ringtone on his Jitterbug.
Connecticut and Nebraska are both high-speed express routes, which is why that particular intersection is so dangerous.
I'm not gonna take any sides in this debate, but just to note that one reason why jaywalkers might seem safer -- some would argue that it is safer to cross in the middle of a block rather than at an intersection. Mid-block, there are only cars coming from two possible directions, while intersections have a much more complex dynamic.
It's not only that, but Nebraska being on a hill means that drivers often can't say very far in front of them, whether coming up or down the street. Same goes for those on Connecticut turning onto Nebraska.
Are the same people complaining about pedestrians wearing earbuds the same listening to music in their car? The issue is not a noise one. i highly doubt anyone wearing earbuds is not going to not hear a car honking at them. That being said if the car is honking then it probably is too late. Stupid people not paying attention are going to act that way regardless of what mind-numbing device they are using either walking, riding, or driving. Blaming the device and not the mouth-breather at the helm of it is like blaming Tito for all of Michael and Latoya's problems. and Tito never done nuthin' to nobody.
People, people, please. Can we not make this a Tito-vs-Jermaine argument? It's bad enough we've excluded the bicyclists from this rant about street bloodletting. Let's not lower anybody else's self esteem.
you see, the bikers are sitting this one out, waiting for the all-encompassing apocalyptic battle when pedestrians and drivers all finally finish each other off.
then we'll be left to rule the world. finally.
game. set. match.
A planet ruled by lycranauts? The living would envy the dead.
Just the idea of lycra made me vomit in my mouth. Maybe thats because the peyote I had for lunch is finally kicking in.
Apropos of nothing, here comes Marlon Jackson with a slavery theme park in Nigeria. I ask you, is there nothing these Jacksons cannot do?
http://opinion.latimes.com/opinionla/2009/02/michael-jackson.html
While waiting for my bus at 14th and Sheridan every morning (a 4-way stop)I witness at least one driver running a stop sign. Hard telling how many there are for the rest of the day. I'm a pretty strong pedestrian rights advocate and I've given cars some pretty good whacks with my fist and umbrella for not giving me the right of way. Why can't drivers read those yellow markers in the middle of the street that say it's the law to give the pedestrian the right of way???
Rather than disallowing left turns, why not install more left-turn-only signals? I am amazed by the number of busy intersections that lack them. This would solve the problem of the mad dash to turn left in the 2-second window of opportunity to do so - which is dangerous for oncoming cars as well as pedestrians.
i agree that we need more dedicated turn signals. a problem, though, is that they tend to be ignored by pedestrians.
at the corner of connecticut and rhode island, there is a right turn signal that means pedestrians have to wait a little longer to legally cross. they rarely do, and there are a lot of conflicts between those pedestrians and right-hand turning traffic. i think if everyone just followed the rules more closely there, there'd be less traffic problems at that corner. a cop writing tickets couldn't hurt...
There are some people that are stuck in the street as the light turns - and that's an instance where I sympathize with the pedestrian - though when that light's about to change, that might be a good time to get a clue, pick up the pace & get the heck outta harm's way.
I think that pedestrians that knowingly walk into oncoming traffic are simply irresponsible and inconsiderate. The ones that slow down their pace as you approach them are the worst. People need to use crosswalks and not walk out into traffic. What makes them think they're so special? If they walk in front of a car and cause an accident, they should be held responsible, vs. the driver (who was most likely caught by surprise when some idiot walked in front of 1 ton of metal that's coming at them @ 30 MPH.)
People need to grow up & take responsibility for their own actions. Parents need to teach their children that when it says "Don't Walk", you don't walk and that crosswalks are your friends. If I walked out into traffic & got hit, it would serve me right. Darwinism at it's best. I should also have to pay for any damage I caused to the vehicle that hit me.
In defense of the pedestrians that act responsibly, let me add that just as there are stupid pedestrians, there are stupid drivers.
I agree with IMGoph, the people that run stop signs & red lights, or the oned that breeze through a stop sign to make a right turn & almost hit pedestrians in a crosswalk should be slapped. Really hard.
I think the MPD should be more proactive re: fining jaywalkers as well as drivers that run red lights/ don't stop at a red light before making a right turn.
Sometimes.
Next question?